did. we love having you. >> i learn if you put international after your name, you are pretty much in the deal. >> richard wolffe international, what did you learn? >> the importance of mothers in guiding us and my mother's birthday. >> happy birthday, mom. you did a great job. little richard still alive. >> it's "morning joe." up next is "the daily rundown" not with chuck todd but with chris cillizza. with the fiscal cliff ticking, friendly territory that got him re-elected. heading to the pennsylvania suburbs with a campaign-style sales pitch to rally support for his proposals. more crucial developments in the

middle east where egyptian leaders push a new constitution. and who do you think had the better lunch on thursday? these guys or this guy? joe biden takes costco by storm. does he do anything else? good morning from washington. it's friday, november 30, 2012, and this is "the daily rundown. i'm chris cillizza in today for chuck todd. the president hits the road today to settle his proposal to avoid the fiscal cliff at a toy factory in the pennsylvania suburbs. the president's opening budget bid landed with a thud on the republican side of capitol hill. after meeting with the president's top negotiator treasury secretary tim geithner, some republicans are calling the white house offer a joke. that's a quote, and a fantasy. that's also a quote. leaving the talks in a familiar place, stalemate. >> no substantive progress has been made in the talks between

the white house and the house over the last two weeks. >> we haven't seen any kind of proposal from the republicans. rates on the top 2%, the wealthiest earners going up. >> it's time for the president, congressional democrats, to tell the american people what spending cuts they're really willing to make. >> republicans know where we stand. we've said it. we've said it. we've said it so many times. >> he says that democrats have got to get serious about cuts, spending cuts. where is the disconnect? >> i don't understand his brain, so you should ask him. >> nbc's kelly o'donnell is live on capitol hill and kristen welker joins us from the white house. can kelly, let's start with you. weigh could -- that could have played six months before the election. we're now 3 1/2 weeks after the election. harry raed saying i don't understand his brain. we are obviously certainly no further down the road to a f

fiscal cliff deal. what's the latest and is this posturing, kelly, or is this real? i mean, is this disagreement about kind of laying out the stakes of where everybody stands and what they're willing to give or is it a possibility that we don't get a deal? >> reporter: well, you do hear rumblings, chris, about no deal. but at the same time people are saying there's still some negotiating time left and a bit of optimism. when you heard the tone of what was unfolding yesterday, it was kind of shocking to republicans who would say that the president's offer is so far from a negotiating point that they are surprised not so much that these are the positions that we're in because much has been the president's public rhetoric but in terms of real negotiating they say they were surprised this wasn't the kind of offer that would have happened some weeks ago, meaning right after the election if you want to start there. but now with just four weeks to go they felt the president needed to move further. democrats believe these are the priorities that voters reinforced with their ballots on

election day and this is where the white house and tem kratz needed to start. you could tell in the room when harry reid was talking about john boehner's brain, that they were really infused by the election. they referenced it so many times in talking about the priorities. specifics were kind of the word of the day. everybody saying the other side has to give specifics. this morning republicans are saying don't expect any public counteroffer after what the president's team presented here, one of their big concerns is the $1.6 trillion in tax revenue over ten years. they say that's about twice where republicans think they might be able to get a deal and for them that was not a good starting point. >> kelly, can i quickly ask you why we should not expect a counteroffer interest republicans? isn't that what this whole game is about? >> reporter: public. if i didn't say public, let me emphasize. >> you did. >> reporter: we heard about the president's offer and what republicans are also saying they are trying hard to not criticize the president publicly, focus on the specifics of the deal.

there are concerns about that, not wanting to spoil the move further. at least that's their claim. so certainly they will be putting their own numbers together but don't expect a big splash of bullet points from republic wrans today or over the weekend. at least that's what we're hearing now. >> the president is going to hatfield, pennsylvania, today. a campaign-style event to sort of drum up support for what the white house wants to do on fiscal cliff. you know, the president after he won re-election essentially said i know lots of you didn't vote for me. i've listened to you. i take your concerns to heart and we're going to move forward. does that apply to congressional republicans, kristen? does he hear what john boehner has to say? does he internalize it? do we hear something acknowledging republican resistance to what he laid out today in pennsylvania or not? >> reporter: well, i think he certainly is hearing and listening to john boehner, but he also believes that he has the upper hand having just won re-election and this trip to

pennsylvania today is sort of a larger pr campaign that the president and the white house have been embarking on to get voters, to pressure congressional republicans to get onboard with the president's plan of increasing taxes on wealthier americans. he's traveling to pennsylvania today. he has had had business leaders here at the white house, also leaders of the progressive movement to sort of build support for his plan and today specifically he'll be visiting a toy manufacturer in pennsylvania to sort of make the case that businesses like the toy manufacturer benefit and will continue to benefit if lawmakers get a deal on this payroll tax cut and if they -- on the fiscal cliff, rather, and if they don't, it could harm consumer can ha confidence and in turn businesses like this one in pennsylvania. but, chris, also expect republicans to sort of lob a counterpunch today. i expect them to sort of highlight a business nearby that could be harmed if taxes do go up on those making $250,000 or

more because, of course, that is for some small businesses their budget level. chris? >> and one thing, a quick follow-up, did the white house -- do you have any indication did the white house expect the reaction they got on capitol hill yesterday? i assume with this proposal, which much of it isn't new. this is essentially the president's budget proposal from last year, that they didn't think john boehner was going to say, that sounds good, let's do that. but did they expect the dismissiveness and john boehner's tone in his press conference yesterday? did that catch them by surprise at all? >> reporter: well, i think the white house democrats were a little surprised by the backlash but, as you point out, this budget proposal is essentially what the president proposed last year. it includes $1.6 trillion in new taxes which kelly mentioned and includes about $400 billion in cuts as well as $50 billion in new stimulus. what's interesting about this proposal and the really new

element that it also includes a call to end congressional oversight of the national spending limit. to essentially get rid of the debt limit fight that was so ugly and left a black eye on lawmakers really on both sides of pennsylvania avenue last year. so i think that they were to some extent surprised by the reaction but, again, democrats are feeling emboldened. democrats urging the president to go big and to really stick to their guns on this one. >> well, they did win. kelly, let me -- i just want to go one other quick thing. it's busy on capitol hill these days. i want to ask you about susan rice, who has spent a lot of her week down on capitol hill meeting with senators, people like susan collins. what susan collins had to say last night about susan rice and let's come back and talk about it. >> i walked out of the meeting with a profound sense of disappointment. i actually presented susan rice to the foreign relations

committee in the senate when she was first nominated to be the u.n. ambassador. so clearly i want her to be successful. i was proud of her. and yet i left that meeting with less of a feeling with about her judgment and about her suitability to be secretary of state. >> now, kelly, much has been made of this. and i think some of it rightly so, susan collins is not a conservative republican. is this -- is this just, again, posturi posturing? because susan collins, what you don't hear susan collins saying if nominated i will vote against her. you've heard few say that. what is this? is it real opposition there with susan rice, or is it kind of talking a warning sign to maybe get more on benghazi if nominated? >> reporter: i do think the leverage to get more on benghazi is a real thing here. i find from senators, they take

so seriously the role of advise and consent for nominees that they try to be very careful about not throwing around the i won't vote for until there are hearings, until there's a nomination. they believe in the process. you pointed out susan collins is important to watch because she is a moderate republican. because she has standing and she is someone who usually doesn't throw firebombs. she is normally very measured. chris? >> kristen, one last thing. we're talking about all of this in hypothetical. susan rice has not been nominated. do we expect movement on that? we know hillary clinton has bun unequivocal she is leaving and there will be an opening. will this move between now and the end of the year whether susan rice or anyone else is nominated? >> reporter: there could be an announcement as early as next week, and i want to stress could be. talk to go senior administration officials and asking them if this resistance that they have

gotten publicly to a rice nomination has in any way dissuaded the president from nominating rice. they tell me, no. they still believe that she would get the votes to be confirmed if she was, in fact, chosen. chris? >> from one end of pennsylvania avenue to the other, kelly o'donnell and kristen welker, thank you. >> thanks. good to see you, chris. now from the third branch of government. we're covering the entire government today. we'll find out if the supreme court will weigh in on a pair of hi high-profile cases that would help define the rights and benefits of same-sex couples. pete williams is the justice correspondent. he joins me from outside the supreme court. good morning, pete. >> reporter: good morning, chris. we're wait to go hear whether the court will take either of these two cases. the defense of marriage act passed in 1996 by congress, signed into law by president clinton. and what it says is that for federal law purposes, marriage can exist only between a man and a woman. so that means this in the nine states where same sex marriage is legal, if a same sex couple

gets married there, they're considered mayrried for state lw but not federal law and the practical consequence is they are denied about 1,000 federal benefits, tax benefits, survivors benefits, to be covered under health insurance. that sort of thing. it will have to decide whether that law is unconstitutional discrimination, denying those couples equal treatment. what the advocates of overturning it say is never before has the federal government done anything but defer to a state's definition of what a legal marriage is. now the second big issue is california's proposition 8. this was the ballot proposition passed, overturned two years ago. what it says is that even though a california court said that marriage was legal in that state, it banned gay mrarnlg in california. now if the court grants that case, then it might -- might -- get to the fundamental issue whether states can, in fact, ban same-sex marriage. my predictions, chris.

it's a virtual certainty the court will take the doma case. courts have overturned an act of congress. it's much less certain they'll take the prop 8 case and we'll only find out today which cases they're going to take because if they're not going to take any cases we won't hear about that until monday. all we get are the grants. no guarantee today but the justices are meeting in a closed door conference. these cases are on the agenda. so we may find out as early as today, chris. >> nbc's justice correspondent pete williams. for the record i would watch a show called pete's predictions. thank you, pete. >> reporter: you'd be the one. next, we'll head to the hill to talk to members from both sides about the fiscal cliff clash. plus, sharp divisions at the united nations. the world defies the u.s. in a historic vote for palestinians. and huge crowds are gathering in tahrir square after egypt approved a controversial new

draft constitution. it's a move that's likely to inflame the political crisis there. we're live in cairo with what it all means for the region. first, a look ahead at the president's schedule. he is in pennsylvania at the toy factory talking fiscal cliff. you're watching "the daily rundown" only on msnbc. [ emily jo ] derrell comes into starbucks with his wife, danielle, almost every weekend. derrell hasn't been able to visit his mom back east in a long time. [ shirley ] things are sometimes a little tight around the house. i wasn't able to go to the wedding. [ emily jo ] since derrell couldn't get home, we decided to bring home to him and then just gave him a little bit of help finding his way. ♪ [ laughs ] [ applause ] i love you. i love you, too.

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mitt romney made it to the oval office yesterday, but not quite in the way he'd envision ed it. the two former rivals talked for over an hour over white turkey chili and southwestern grilled chicken salad. delicious. in the private dining room just

off the oval office. after a sharp eye spotted boxing gloves in the photograph, aides joked there were no punches thrown. nbc senior political editor mark murray is here with this morning's first read. mark, the picture is worth 1,000 words. that's why they did this, for the picture. >> it was a symbolic moment. not a lot was said. we've gotten little reporting on any big substance, but you could argue the symbolism does matter. we had a campaign that essent l essentially lasted two years, a lot of tough words, a very personal campaign and it proves to the american public that, you know what, we can all move on as a country even after a tough campaign, that life goes on, you accept who wins. you accept who loses even in a close contest after 2,000 which was a statistical tie between al gore and george w. bush, the country does move on and we head to the next election. >> i always say to people, look,

mitt romney didn't come all that close to winning. he didn't come as close as i thought he might. one quick other follow-up on this, the thing i've been struck by, does mitt romney retain a constituency within the repub c republican party? he was the nominee. he got the votes. but it doesn't seem like he's having much influence. he's not in office right now so is not doing -- i don't see him returning to an office. he's not going to run for president again. does he kind of just shuffle off to the side? >> it really seems that way. one of the more amazing things is the imprint he had on the republican party, its ideas, seem so little right now particularly just weeks after the presidential election. you can make the argument even john mccain who lost decisively in 2008, all the republicans and the tea party people who are demanding an end to earmarks, there was john mccain, and very little -- one of the calls mitt romney ended up having that republicans are still having today. >> the one i can think of is a possibility of capping the

deductions people can take. that's something he proposed late. it seems like republicans want to forget very quickly what happened. but we will not forget yet because there is some level still we're three and a half weeks from the election, some level of postmortem. a lead strategist for romney wrote an op-ed in "the washington post" earlier this week calling romney's campaign that he did the right thing. he ran the right campaign. he was the right man for the right time. that his campaign became a national movement. those are his words not mine. a republican strategist, i want to show you what she tweeted. here is what she tweeted. she said, agree with stuart stevens. romney's campaign was a national movement. latinos and women across the nation moved as far as they could from him. obviously mocking. why is stuart stevens doing this? he's been doing appearances on television lately, too. in which he acknowledged we should have done better with hispanic women.

what is this about? >> the message from that "washington post" op-ed, what we did mattered. we still lost. people are criticizing it. you've heard ana navarro, a lot of people actually ended up saying and, chris, you know this point for the republican party is really important. remember, democrats in 2004 after they lost the presidential election, you look at how do we move ahead? the lessons of the republican party ends up learning right now will help it in 2014. will help it in 2016. republicans i talked to say, look, the most important lesson to learn, demographics, is ana navarro talking about message does matter. the party still has issues. look at its popularity ratings versus the democratic party. and so you end up looking at those things and also finally, tactics do matter. some of the things stuart stevens and the romney campaign did when you look at their ad buying, the quality of their ads, was their polling correct? a lot of people said -- >> how about the summer months where he focused on obama and

the economy. i want to talk about, because i can't resist it, it's almost 2013. i think we're well within the bounds. the virginia governor's race. bill bolling, the lieutenant governor, dropped out in twain to make way for bob mcdonnell, currently the governor, dropped out again this week to make way for state attorney jgeneral ken cucinell cucinelli. you have the best friend of bill clinton terry mcauliffe as the democratic nominee. some people are painting this as a tea party against the clintons in mcauliffe. things can still happen. it looks like a fascinating race. >> chris, as you know, political reporters, we only have two gubernatorial races to cover. we give a lot of attention to

virginia and new jersey. what's fascinating about virginia, since i've been covering politics on the national stage, the off-year election has proved to be a template if that party that's out of power wins. 2005, tim kaine ends up running a race, appealing to independents, sfresing his religious faith. actually kind of having a very soft appeal to a lot of folks. he's adopted that 2006 and 2008. a lot of the ideas barack obama ran on in 2008 was tim cane. >> he endorsed him for president, just as a sidebar. >> mcdonnell was focused like a laser on the economy. what did we see republicans do? focus on the economy. try to turn social issues away. he was very successful in 2005. house republicans and senate republicans successful. mitt romney not so much in 2012. that's why virginia does matter. >> testing ground. no question, i would say virginia, new jersey, new york city and l.a. mayoral races.

mark murray, thank you. >> thanks. now for more on the fiscal cliff, the white house is daring republ republicans literally to blink pushing a plan with few, if any, concessions. the president will make his case later today. with me now from the democratic side is new hampshire congresswoman elect carol porter who is returning to congress after losing her seat in 2010. thank you for joining me. i want to start with this. in 2010 you found yourself on the wrong end of a wave election. people blame barack obama and the state of the economy, health care, what have you. now in 2012 you come back and you beat the guy who beat you and you're back, soon to be, in congress. tell me what lessons you learned in 2012? what was in your mind in a swing state of new hampshire the 2012 election about and what does it carry forward? >> well, first, let me say in 2010 there was a lot of misinformation about health care

and about other issues we were voting on. and so people were understandably frightened and now as the health care law is being carried out they recognize that this is a very consumer friendly law. and so that has changed. the issues in this past election the proper role of government, and i was running against the tea partier who wanted to shut down so much of government functions and people recognize that they really do want to have good government. but they do want efficient government and they want to make sure they're watching out for their tax dollars. they do want medicare, social security. they want those programs. they just want us to be fiscally responsible and move this country forward. i think it was a big ideological shift, again, and it's our job now to work with each other to get this country past the financial and to work on the issues americans sent us to do. >> you mentioned the fiscal cliff and i want to ask you about it. president obama even in his p -

proposal yesterday had entitlement cuts including to medicare. you have in the past been resistant to cutting entit entitlements. does the result of the election -- i've heard many people on the democratic side say, look, we won. we don't need to make concess n concessions to republicans on entitlements. we can raise the top rates without making these concessions. do you think the president is even in this first proposal giving away too much on the entitlement side? >> i think it's important to note that there's a difference between working to cut medicare and protecting the benefits. and itch said repeatedly that i will not vote to cut the benefits people have earned and depend on because they put those benefits into place, one, this in the middle of a depression, social security, and the other one, medicare, because they were needed. republicans and democrats recognized they needed these programs because people got old and people got sick and they still do. so i will not work to cut those benefits. but when the president talks about looking at other places to

cut, i think it's reasonable to look. let's be more efficient. let's go and do more oversight for waste, fraud and inefficiency across the whole government spectrum. there's plenty of room, i think, to negotiate here. but personally speaking for myself, i will not cut benefits are tore medicare and social security recipients. they need them. they earned them and it really is important that we have them there for them. >> congresswoman, very quickly, i've heard some republicans saying privately they think democrats are okay with going off the fiscal cliff for a week two. if a deal cannot be made that suits your specifications you lay out, are you comfortable with doing that? >> let's hope that this congress will pull it together and do what they should have been doing all along which is to take care of this and i think the thing to do right now is to pass the tax cuts for the middle class. republicans and democrats both agree that those tax cuts for the middle class need to be

preserved. so let's see them do that. >> congresswoman carol shea-porter, soon to be a member of the first all-female, as well as the governor of new hampshire, all women. thank you for taking time out of your morning. thank you for joining us. >> thank you. coming up, the other side of the aisle on the fiscal cliff fig fight. tennessee republican congresswoman diane black joins us. plus, the latest on the condition of former president george h.w. bush who is in the houston hospital right now. but first, today's trivia question, it's a good one. how many u.s. presidents have also served as the united states ambassador to the united nations? not easy.

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on our radar this morning, former president is in the hospital but on the mend and one republican member gets creative for not signing the tax pledge. but first the senate is set to consider a broader set of sanctions on iran to find new ways to cut off revenues they think fund the country's nuclear program. this is the third time this year that lawmakers have looked for new ways to curtail money going into iran. last night secretary of state hillary clinton was hopeful regarding a march deadline for progress on nuclear inspection talks. >> we continue to believe that there is still a window of opportunity to reach some kind of resolution over iran's nuclear program. doctors in houston say former president george h.w. bush is recovering quickly from bronchitis.

the 88-year-old bush was admitted to the hospital for a lingering cough. doctors say while it was never a serious or life threatening situation they wanted to prevent the illness from growing into pneumonia. he is sitting up, walking, and moving around as much as he can and could be discharged as soon as this weekend. on the campaign watch, new hampshire republican representative frank guinta who lost to carol shea-porter is now wondering a 2014 senate run against new hampshire democratic senator jean shaheen. guinta said his name has come up for senate, house, and governor, and that he plans to, quote, see how things play out. gop sources say guinta has expressed a particular interest in the senate race. and finally this might be one of the best excuses we've heard yet from republicans arguing against the grover norquist tax pledge. chris gibson says the pledge he signed in 2010 no longer applies since redistricting changed the

numbers. he signed as a candidate for new york's 20th congressional district and said moving forward he doesn't plan to re-sign it for the 19th congressional district for which he now represents. okay. the opening bell just rang. let's get right to the market rundown. cnbc's becky quick is here. good morning, becky. >> reporter: good morning, chris. great to see you. we are looking now at the markets just opening and they're opening relatively flat. modest declines for the s&p and nasdaq. modest gains for the dow. that's a surprise today because when you came in this morning you might have expected to see a lot of red arrows. we have been trading almost in lock step with the headlines that have been coming out of washington around the fiscal cliff. when it looks like there is some movement made, when it looks like there's a deal that could be reached, you see the markets go up. when things look bleaker, the markets are going down. that's not the case today and has people wondering, okay, is this just posturing?

is wall street getting used to the posturing and where do we go from here? personal income numbers were unchanged and consumer spending numbers down. that was worse than expected. these numbers were thrown off by sandy. at this point i think wall street is easing into friday. chris, back to you. >> maybe they're just happy it's friday, becky. >> reporter: i am. well, it didn't take long for republicans to reject the president's proposed solution to

the fiscal cliff crisis. now harry reid says it's the republicans turn to put out their own plan. with me now tennessee republican congresswoman diane black who is a member of both the budget and ways and means committees. congresswoman, thank you for joining me. we had some reporting earlier that said don't expect any public counter prproposal from republicans. can i ask you why not? >> well, i think, chris, that you can just look at what we did before the election. actually the medicare is what we put the plan out for and we also have a plan out there to avert the fiscal cliff and sequestration. our plans are already there. and we're just waiting for the president to come out with a plan. everything we're hearing is so one-sided. it's all about taxes and now he's telling us he wants to spend $1.6 trillion more than what he had in his budget plans before.

>> i want to play something, tom cole, a colleague was yours had to say on this show yesterday. why he thinks the republicans should make a deal. >> if we can give the american people an early christmas present, if they can list en to the debate instead of be worried that their own taxes will go up, i think that strengthens our hand. our leverage is not tax rates. that's the democrats' leverage. our leverage, in my view, are spending cuts. the democrats don't want any domestic spending cuts. they're going to happen if there's not a deal. he doesn't want any more defense cuts either. >> by way of context, house speaker john boehner came out, has come out and said, look, we are not in support of what tom cole is saying.

tell me why the republican house conference doesn't think that's a smart strategy? >> first of all, great respect for representative cole. he is a very fine man and he is a very good thinker as well, but i don't agree with him either on this one. we know that the proposal by the president is going to hit 1 million small business owners. ernst and young has told us 700,000 jobs because of that. that doesn't help the middle class at all. and this is very important we do protect the middle class and this is not the way to do that. stop just talk iing about taxes only. here's the thing. if you just look at what the president wants to do by raising taxes on those small business owners, about a million of them,

we'll only bring in eight days of revenue to send us to fund the federal government. what about the other 350 plus days? it makes it sound like the panacea is only on one side. we need to have tax reform. we need to bring tax reform, to cut taxes and we need to reform our debt drivers which are social security and medicare. >> i want to ask you about one other thing, it's gotten a lot of attention earlier this week. house republicans named their committee chairman for a wide variety of communities. all 19 were male. now you know as well as i do that republicans in the 2012 election struggled among women losing that vote and losing particularly among hispanic women badly. is this -- we're showing all their faces on screen. is this a problem in your mind for the republican party? do you need more female voices in positions of leadership within the congress? >> well, here is the position of

lead leadership that is not talked about on the other side. we elected our leadership and at the head of our conference is kathy rogers. our vice chair is lynn jenkins and our secretary is virginia fox. so we have three women in the top leadership positions of our conference and yet that's not talked about on the other side. >> well, thanks for making the point, congresswoman diane black of tennessee. i appreciate your time. >> thank you, chris. it's good to be with you. a programming note this sunday on "meet the press" treasury secretary tim geithner on the closed door capitol hill negotiations over the fiscal cliff. and now an update on the situation in egypt. a government panel rushed to approve a draft constitution in a move that's inflaming the power struggle. the panel made up almost entirely of morsi islamist supporters, held an all-night vote to approve the constitution after the judiciary threat e ebbened to dissolve before the

work was done. street clashes have erupted between president morsi supporters and protesters upset over decrease he granted himself sweeping powers. the u.n. human rights chief says morsi's decree is an attempt to put himself beyond the law. up next in our gaggle, a fiscal cliff forecast plus duraflame logs, apple pie, a tv, these are just a few of the things that joe biden, the vice president of these united states, picked up at krostco on thursday. but first, it's the white house soup of the day, of course. roasted chicken and vegetable. when i got up this morning it was 28 degrees out. so that's a nice hearty soup to make me feel better about things. don't forget to check out our website. ♪

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this season, discover aleve. oh, let me guess --ou see this? more washington gridlock. no, it's worse -- look, our taxes are about to go up. not the taxes on our dividends though, right? that's a big part of our retirement. oh, no, it's dividends, too. the rate on our dividends would more than double. but we depend on our dividends to help pay our bills. we worked hard to save. well, the president and congress have got to work together to stop this dividend tax hike. before it's too late.

until that time i hadn't thought much about gun control or the need for gun control. maybe if i had, i wouldn't be stuck with these damn wheels. >> his wife sarah -- >> daily flashback to this day in 1993 when former white house press secretary jim brady spoke at the signing of the gun control bill that bears his name. president clinton signed the brady bill into law 12 years after brady was shot in an assassination attempt on president ronald reagan. the law requires a five-day waiting period and background checks noord to buy a handgun. president obama made the opening bid in the fiscal cliff negotiation sending his plan to capitol hill on thursday. $1.6 trillion in tax hikes and $50 billion in new spending. but house republicans, surprise-surprise, say democrats aren't being serious. >> the president has warned us about the dangers of going over the fiscal cliff. but his actions have not matched

his public statements. members of his own party seem quite comfortable sending the economy over the fiscal cliff. >> let's bring in our friday gaggle, associate editor and columnist for the hill amy stoddard, danielle gibbs, and columnist for bloomberg view and national review and one of the funnier people on twitter and he did not pay me to say that but i will start with you. so we kind of feel like we're back to square one. should republicans having seen them lose the presidency by a wider margin than many people thought lose seats in the senate which i don't think almost anybody -- unless you're a loyal democrat thought, and lose seats, though, to keep control of the house three and a half weeks ago. should they be more willing to say let's just do a deal here and move on? we kind of lost that argument.

we need to pick a better fight. >> i think republicans -- before the election they were dead set against any increase in taxes on upper income people or anybody. and they have moved on that but there's a limit how far they can move and the deal put forward yesterday, john boehner could endorse that tomorrow. he is not getting that through the house republicans. >> and that's a good point. and, daniella, we focus a lot on republicans and the divide between what john boehner wants and what the tea party or the conservative wing of this caucus wan, but we had carol shea-porter on earlier and she said she's not going to vote in the lame duck, in the fiscal cliff but will be a member in january. there are $400 billion in the entitlement cuts. is the president in danger of giving away too much in a deal

that's good for him in his legacy but maybe not good and do you have the same problem that was pointed out, republicans might have, can you get democrats to vote for it in the congress? >> i think that's the main sticking point. no harm to beneficiaries. it's difficult for republicans at this moment but they lost and they have to put something on the table. i haven't heard what cuts to entitle lment they're going to do. what loopholes will close. >> i want to talk about the stickiest wicket in all of this which is rates. tax rates. here is nancy pelosi and jim clyburn on thursday.

>> the president has been clear and we support him. expiration of tax cuts for those making over $250,000 a year. >> now what's interesting here we've covered a lot of this break with grover norquist among some republicans but in truth what they're saying is well, we don't believe closing loopholes is okay. no one has said we definitely should raise rates the top earners. is that a bridge too far or how much do you give up? is that a bridge too far for republicans or do you think we're moving slowly but surely for some kind of deal before the end of the year? >> republicans keep making clear in private they're not going to defend millionaires and if the threshold is raised to $500,000,

$750,000, they're going to break and the rate is going to budge. >> the small business argument. >> if you find caps in deduction and add a compromise on rates which is widely discussed, the white house knows it. the republican leadership has made it all but clear in public. and i just think that that is a republicans' part. a big concession. they won, too. it is not -- there is a public mandate for raising the taxes on the top 2%, but there's not a mandate for nothing else and no spending cuts. and so there really has to be some give on both sides. i think republicans have given. they might, from a public relations standpoint, chris, start coming up with those specific numbers about which loopholes. they might put math on paper to fight back. >> this would be acceptable and this would not. >> but obviously yesterday's bid was unacceptable. the white house knew that going in. and it is a time waster. it poisons the well.

it makes john boehner's task really tricky because now the members are furious. to me it's frustrating because it looks like people are only going for a small deal just to get us past the cliff. they're not really interested in what it will take to get to $4 trillion. >> i'm always struck by the similarities between congress and my roommates in college, which is they do not do anything until the day before the paper is due. no deal can ever be done until 20 minutes before a deal has to be done. we'll come and talk about that. sorry, roommates in college. trivia time. we asked how many u.s. presidents have also served as u.s. ambassador to the united nations? the answer is just one. george h.w. bush is the only person to have held both positions. i did not know that. if you've got political trivia for us, e-mail us at dailyrundown@msnbc.com, and we will be right back. wasn't my daughter's black bean soup spectacular?

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in all honesty, i didn't have my own card. jill wouldn't let me have one. hey, craig. >> how are you? >> so i went to get my wife's card, and she said no, no, no, you get your own. >> that's our vice president. let's bring back our gaggle, amy stoddard and remesh. danielle, i want to go to you first because while i thought this was just hilarious and the visuals out of it like the watch, shopping, and that he doesn't need tires. it's just comic gold. the "saturday night live" writers are, like, thank you! is there a serious point here, or is this just joe biden saw that there's a costco opening in d.c. and wanted to go to it. he's the vice president of the united states, you get to do what you want. >> it's probably a little bit of both. the ceo of costco has always been a great supporter of the administration and they have a great story about how they treat their employees. it makes sense to me that the first one that opens in d.c. that the vice president would go there and show support and also

get some delicious pies. >> way to get the pies line in there. joe biden has been as open as anyone to say he's thinking about running in 2016. shameless plugs. amy stoddard. >> i know that chuck todd gave shawn spicer of the rnc and shawn woodhouse of the dnc a huge plug this week about the fact this they shaved their heads for childhood cancer research at st. baldric's foundation, but they are not at their $8,000 and $6,000 goals yet. they need one last plug to get them over the line. >> next week, center for american progress is hosting a great event on tuesday where we're looking at the obama coalition in 2012 and beyond to see if we can hold this together. >> that's fascinating. yes, ramesh. >> in "the los angeles times," the kato institute explains how state governments can protect citizens from an unpopular health care law. >> i don't know. i don't get the context. thank you all. my shameless plug is eight days ago and 43 years ago, my

parents, john and mary ellen, were married. happy anniversary, mom and dad. that's it for this edition of "the daily rundown." and never fear, the goateed one, chuck todd, will be back on monday. coming up next on msnbc and chris jansing & company. enjoy your weekend. why is cdw like an i.t. caddy? because they provide solutions for all situations. how? they work with vmware to provide virtualization and cloud solutions tailored to a company's unique i.t. needs.

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